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Banned for idling, and they wouldnt unban

Moderator: MiRai

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creo

ISBoxer Expert

Posts: 33

Joined: Mon Nov 30, 2009 2:14 pm

Post Thu Feb 04, 2010 11:48 am

Re: Banned for using isboxer/innerspace

I have to say this is unfortunate to get a ban for the events as you described them. I have to agree with the comments made as well though, that if the multiboxing setup had not been mentioned in any conversation (since only one char was initially banned), things may have worked out. If I understood your detailed post, the ban was for a few days and not permanent initially?

One lesson to learn here I would say: Do not volunteer any information beyond the very basics or minimal detail required under the circumstances. Based on that ridiculously general article 18, there is entirely too much latitude that can be wielded by an individual GM if they take a dislike to what ever you tell them, or even what they just suspect.

Based on some of the proposed legislature that would hold software companies such as Microsoft, Turbine / Codemasters, etc... responsible for the quality and suitability of their products, I would think that such a ludicrous wording in a EULA as article 18 would set them up for a rather interesting law suit should someone or some group decide to take them to task over it.

I am curious what their official response would be if they were sent an email, or better yet a formal legal document through registered mail, requesting permission for any number of 100+ typical 3rd party apps that could potentially reside on the average home PC. Beyond the normal productivity and utility apps, there could be dozens of additional games if the system was a gaming rig. And, as pointed out, even the OS would be a breach of the EULA.

As a comment on the disconnect between EU and NA GMs and how things are handled, I have know many individuals that have had bans for various reasons in LOTRO on the NA servers. Generally, the first ban received is 3 to 7 days in duration regardless of the reason for the ban. In the case where there was an assumption made by a GM which was disputed and where there was no additional evidence related to the incident, the ban was rescinded when challenged by the player. Even multiple offenses for what would be considered actual EULA breaches by most people have only received longer bans (non-permanent) in most cases. However, in the few EU server related incidents that I have known of, the bans were much more harsh and in many cases the initial ban was permanent with little or no recourse available for resolution. I would say Codemasters is not looking to establish a healthy thriving client base in the EU market...

Cheers,

creo
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Ualaa

Grandmaster Guidesmith

Posts: 714

Joined: Wed Nov 18, 2009 8:36 pm

Post Thu Feb 04, 2010 4:20 pm

Re: Banned for using isboxer/innerspace

kasmar45 wrote:Your post title is a little misleading. You were initially banned for not responding to a GM tell, not for using ISBoxer. ISBoxer is okay to use as long as you do not use the key repeat feature to do any action repetitively unassisted. If you use key repeat for what it was designed for then you are okay.


Key Repeating in IS Boxer, is simply broadcasting the one keystroke you make to more then the current window/account. Repeater does not refer to pressing the key once, and having it press itself multiple times with any form of delays. In the context of IS Boxer, repeater = broadcast.

There is no function in IS Boxer to automatically repeat the same key over and over. You physically have to push the key each and every time, ie be at the computer and actively participating.
Streaming in 720p HD: www.twitch.tv/ualaa
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Xtremepayne

Posts: 47

Joined: Fri Nov 27, 2009 8:10 pm

Post Thu Feb 04, 2010 6:09 pm

Re: Banned for using isboxer/innerspace

I don't see how Codemasters can afford to many bans. Where they are struggling to get new players and having lifetime members who don't pay a monthly subscription is like shooting yourself in the foot. If anything I could see the few days bans but looking at it from a business perspective, Bans are bad for business.
I could see it in an extreme case, but it wasn't like he was out in the North Downs gathering resourses or killing everything in sight. Hell, I know people who go /afk and then set their character to craft till it logs out on its own and they go to bed. They just as bad if not worse because they planned it and repeatedly do it. Not once have I ever heard of them getting a ban for unattended game play.
Being that it was a boxer that got a ban would lead one to suspect prejudice against them. At least that what I would think knowing what I do about those afk crafters who do it all the time.
I think you all can see my point here and sadly to say this person might be the target of venting that prejudice on.
I am not saying that its whats going on, but it gives you something to think about. I was talking to my kinshipmates last night and we were discussing this and the crafting afk'ers which is what lead me to this point. Which is the same point that got him, afk.
Sorry, But this bothers me some, being that he was just afk to get noticed. Everyone who plays this game at some time or other will go afk at some point to take a bio break and it makes them just as guilty. My what I am trying to say is that this GM needs to lighten up some and I think this should be reevaluated.
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Digitalxero

Posts: 25

Joined: Wed Feb 03, 2010 1:14 am

Post Thu Feb 04, 2010 6:21 pm

Re: Banned for using isboxer/innerspace

I woul write another letter to them demanding a full and complete list of applications you are allowed to run while playing because that rule is too far reaching. I would also ask them to actually investigate what ISBoxer is and tell them to join the chat room and ask Lax about it so they they can add it to their list of acceptable applications to run.
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kasmar45

Posts: 50

Joined: Sun Dec 20, 2009 8:05 pm

Post Thu Feb 04, 2010 8:29 pm

Re: Banned for idling, and they wouldnt unban

I know at least player that was banned for crafting unattended. The GM sent him a tell and he did not respond, even though his char was actively tanning hides. BAN....

Most likely in the OP's case, the GM had been watching him play for awhile and when his char went idle, the GM sent him a tell, which the OP failed to respond to...
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Venidor215

Posts: 6

Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2010 3:17 am

Post Fri Feb 05, 2010 3:26 am

Re: Banned for idling, and they wouldnt unban

To Creo, yes ban was permanent from the start (never heard of temp bans on my server). Have been looking arround, apparently i have no recourse other than the senior gm i spoke to, he is the only senior for french server. For him multiboxing is just having several accounts online at the same time, and there is no way to make all characters fighting without using forbidden software or hardware ... i did not know before french gm were so stubborn and miss-informed ...

To Digitalxero, it would be interesting if they reply and take time to respond for is boxer ... did you mail turbine or codemaster?

Well, maybe i give it a try on turbine's servers, they are way cheaper than codemasters anyway ... started a 10 days trial, there should be no reasons i could not play on us servers from europe. The main thing i have to be sure, is that they are really more used and tolerant with multiboxing, playing in english will be fine and even allowing me some progresses :D

Best regards.
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Venidor215

Posts: 6

Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2010 3:17 am

Post Fri Feb 05, 2010 7:48 am

Re: Banned for idling, and they wouldnt unban

Hey ! i was not idle at all ! i was playing and fighting !

I was banned for the use software while boxing ...
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creo

ISBoxer Expert

Posts: 33

Joined: Mon Nov 30, 2009 2:14 pm

Post Fri Feb 05, 2010 12:32 pm

Re: Banned for idling, and they wouldnt unban

You mentioned that the ban occurred while you were on your way to DD, but I think in your comments about what the GM told you, he said he had observed you AFK while in esteldin and sent you a tell. I believe that is what was being referred to previously.

As for NA servers under Turbine being more tolerant of multi-boxing there are some videos posted on youtube of a player that has been doing it for some time. These even show his char names (although not his server) which could be easily traced should Turbine take offense to it. Here is one link:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BEBnS_hnScU&feature=channel

I have had many comments sent to me while I am running my team of 5 RKs that are all dressed alike and have names that only vary by a single letter, are all dwarfs that all look alike, same hair style / color, same beard, etc... It is rather easy to be spotted in this case as they all follow a main and perform actions in unison. Some of the comments have been negative (from players) and some positive, some just curious. But, I have not had any contact from a GM at any time in all my experience with running a team. This is my second team which is now almost to 50. My first team is all at 65 and was a mix of classes and not so easily spotted y other players. I have had my 5 RK team sitting in the esteldin crafting hall for hours at a time while I ground my crafting proficiency up on my explorer, tailor, jeweler, etc... Often times, they have all been AFK for lengthy periods without any incidents.

It is unfortunate that you cannot move your existing accounts from the EU servers, but I would say that the NA servers under Turbine are much more tolerant of many things including multi-boxing. The only permanent bans that I have heard of were for extensive botting with the intent to sell the gold for $$. And, even in this case it was after at least 3 previous shorter term bans of increasingly longer duration.

Cheers,

creo
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Venidor215

Posts: 6

Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2010 3:17 am

Post Fri Feb 05, 2010 3:10 pm

Re: Banned for idling, and they wouldnt unban

Yes as i did mention the ban occured while i was on my way to uruk leader ... was already at 3rd gate fighting lots of elites, the first gm said i was near a npc (not specified at all) and not moving, and that all my character disapeared at the same time. That is what i said i find very strange.

To be precise, i logged in that afternoon, made the way back to esteldin on foot, killed 80+ cold wurms(dunno the exact name) in ram duath to advance my trait, then i made the quest of drestroying shiel, arms rakes and food supplys in the north east side of north downs ... went to esteldin to bank and clean bags etc ... made all this one character by one, just used arrows to remove afk on the others computers ... then i went out , wanted to try fornost and finish quests there, i tped to the entrance with hunter as it is his firecamp, then alt tabbed to check quests requirements, and saw that i missed one with the uruk leader in dol dinen as requirement, tped first to the shire to validate another quest at the matom house and then went back to esteldin, there i went on horse and went to dol dinen, i got off horse after the firsts wargs, cleared my way trough first door, second too, arrived at the third door, i was banned while fighting the elites that were standing on each side. Can t tell for sure if gm did send me a private tell, usually i hear a sound when i receive one ... never heard it while fighting nor before. Talked in guild, traded stuff between characters carefully, went to direct objectives of quests, did rework some cosmetics ... can t really be mistaken for a bot ... well they did not even care to verify.

Well for the euro accounts, i don t think transfer exist, anyway i quite like the challenge of starting over as long as i can enjoy the game, i really like lotro, but codemasters went too far and i will not give them one more €.
If anyone can advise me a server by the way, no idea yet to choose. French servers were more easy, one rp, one non rp and both are very low population.

Best regards
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creo

ISBoxer Expert

Posts: 33

Joined: Mon Nov 30, 2009 2:14 pm

Post Fri Feb 05, 2010 5:49 pm

Re: Banned for idling, and they wouldnt unban

I am not really sure of the populations for the NA servers. I believe that the Brandywine server is one of the higher popultions. May want to check the Turbine forums and determine server loads from there as a possible resource.

Cheers,

creo
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